Metal&Shit Forums

I sorta agree with you Will. I'm not saying one should forget what he's done, but I feel in order to get better acquainted with a person's art, it is essential to research the artist behind the music; get to know the mind behind the tunes. But one thing I will say is that I don't feel it's wrong to put Varg on a pedastal, at least not for his musical impact. His influence, his birthing of an entire genre, is undebatable.

Putting him on a pedestal musically, I have no moral qualms; merely aural qualms (if I may be pithy). Respect the man's art if you must, but not the man himself.

Indeed. It's the same situation as with Wagner; the dude was a major antisemite, and were he alive today, I'd probably have some choice words for the dude; but still he produced amazing and influential works.

I believe I just saw Varg Vikernes compared to Wagner. What will the internet think of next?

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Also, Varg didn't birth a goddamn thing, black metal was alive and well without Burzum, and his contribution to Mayhem was slim to none. He may have been AMONGST the forerunners, but the trail blazer he was not. Hell, the man he killed did more to influence Black Metal with his work on "De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas".

Varg single-handedly gave birth to the entire genre of ambient black metal, and to argue otherwise is to admit to having a fundamental misunderstanding of black metal.

Also, fuck Euronymous. De Mysteriis is great but nowhere near in the same league as the first four Burzum albums.

(10-05-2011 10:55 PM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]De Mysteriis is great but nowhere near in the same league as the first four Burzum albums.

Aaaaand that's where you're wrong. DMDS is the pinnacle of black metal.

Close, but no cigar.

(10-05-2011 10:55 PM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]Varg single-handedly gave birth to the entire genre of ambient black metal, and to argue otherwise is to admit to having a fundamental misunderstanding of black metal.

Uh...

I was listening to Det Som Engang Var on the way home. Fucking killer album!

(10-06-2011 09:50 AM)Farted Wrote: [ -> ]Uh...

(10-05-2011 10:55 PM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]ambient black metal

Ie: Fusing both ambient and black metal into one cohesive sound.

I know early Bathory has ambience, but there is a difference between music with ambience, and "ambient" as a genre, which is what I am talking about. Bathory has not combined the two genres, like Varg did on Hvis Lyset or Filosofem.

Agree to disagree.

On further exploration, I do have to admit you're right. I suppose when it comes right down to it, I dislike crediting Varg with much more than making what truly was a pinnacle, groundbreaking black metal album with Filisofem. Everything else he's done has either been shit or solid gold that was far too unique (prison era albums) to be considered anything but a sound of their own, even in comparison to his other music.


On that note, I actually just had my first listen to Fallen a couple of days ago. He's matured quite a bit as a songwriter, and there's still that amateur charm in his brave attempt at playing every instrument when guitar is obviously his strong suit. I think I would rank it above all else except the aforementioned Filosofem and the two prison records.

Hvis Lyset is a masterpiece when it comes to ambient black metal. Even Filosofem fails to top it imo.

(10-09-2011 03:25 AM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]Even Filosofem fails to top it imo.

That's because the 15 minute ambient track ruins the entire flow of Filosofem. That would be the top album for me sans the ambient track.

(10-09-2011 03:25 AM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]Hvis Lyset is a masterpiece when it comes to ambient black metal. Even Filosofem fails to top it imo.

Yeah, Hvis Lyset is the only Burzum album I remotely enjoy.

(10-09-2011 07:16 AM)The Ozzman Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-09-2011 03:25 AM)The Butt Wrote: [ -> ]Even Filosofem fails to top it imo.

That's because the 15 minute ambient track ruins the entire flow of Filosofem. That would be the top album for me sans the ambient track.

A matter of interpretation, like all things. That last bit of ambiance sets me in a mood that I cannot explain after the more aggressive passages of Filosofem. It's like the calm after a storm, a strangely peaceful moment of reflection, introspection with a tinge of dread at knowing you have to take account of the damage done. I don't know, but it's one of my favorite parts about Filosofem.